Wettish Property Development Advisory Sub-Committee Special Meeting November 6, 2008
Killingworth Park and Recreation Commission
Wettish Property Development Advisory Sub-Committee Special Meeting November 6, 2008
1. Call to order
The Killingworth Park and Recreation Commission and Wettish Property Development Advisory Sub-Committee held a special meeting on Thursday, November 6, 2008, at the Killingworth Town Office Building, 323 Route 81, Killingworth, Connecticut.
Present: Dan Colonia
Susan Otto
Susan Dean
Chris Kelly
Bill Silas (arrived at 8:45 PM)
Absent: John Machold
Scott Thomas
Chairman Dan Colonia called the meeting to order at 8:35 PM.
2. Visitors: Eric Auer
Glen Johnson
Richard Otto
3. Well
Dan Colonia stated that he had received two estimates for well drilling from Weston & Sampson earlier in the day:
• Simonelli Well Drilling - $3,555.00 to drill 6” well (the same amount they quoted in August, 2008) and $3,000.00 to test flow and recovery rates.
• Sima Drilling - $3935.00 to drill 6” well and 4100.00 to test flow and recovery rates.
Since the amount to drill is under $5000.00, John Figurelli sent these quotes with the suggestion that Park & Recreation could have the well drilled themselves, without Weston & Sampson’s involvement. This would save the 5% Weston & Sampson surcharge that would be added if they contracted with the Commission to do the well-drilling. Discussion followed between Chris Kelly and Dan regarding whether Weston & Sampson was authorized by the commission at its last meeting to obtain these quotes, or was authorized to present a proposal to obtain the quotes. Chris further questioned Weston & Sampson’s procedures stating that any well-drilling bids should have come directly into Town Hall to prevent collusion between bidders. Chris also questioned why the water requirements were not determined and specified prior to obtaining these quotes, so the Commission would know what water was needed. Eric Auer noted that if an expense is less that $5000.00, then it does not have to go out to bid and added that he felt it was critical to determine how much water is available on the property. Eric questioned why the Commission would want to pay the additional Weston & Sampson surcharge if it was not necessary and Dan further noted that Weston & Sampson had given the town an opportunity to save money. Extensive discussion followed debating the need to drill a well to find water versus the need to specify the required flow and recovery rates prior to drilling a well. Dick Otto questioned whether Weston & Sampson was automatically authorized to solicit bids because they were already under contract with the town, but Chris stated that was not the case.
Dick further suggested that the Commission examine the budget and determine the steps necessary to present to the Board of Selectmen and the Town. Since the bottom line of $1.3M is higher than the $1M cap the Board of Selectmen had implied, Dick suggested the Commission look seriously for ways to reduce costs, and reducing the irrigation expenses might be an option. He urged the Commission to examine the true cost of the project. Eric questioned the Commission’s ability to complete a $1M project if it cannot make a decision on a $4000.00 well, and he confirmed the selectmen’s $1M budget cap. He also noted that if the well issue is not resolved then the budget cannot be addressed. Discussion of the approved concept followed between Bill Silas and Chris.
Glen Johnson noted that Weston & Sampson did in fact give a proposal and gave the town an opportunity to save money. Bill quoted the Weston & Sampson proposal satisfying the motion passed at the previous meeting to get a proposal from them. Glen further offered to witness the well testing and certify the results himself at no cost to the town, adding to the town’s savings. He added that these savings could reduce the overall Weston & Sampson contract by as much as $10,000, but Chris disagreed saying that since the size of the well had not yet been determined it may not save any money. Chris further cautioned that the drilling company could possibly drill down (up to the $5,000.00 authorization limit) and then have to stop without hitting water. The commission agreed that the pump test must be conducted at the same time as the drilling and discussed 6” versus 8” wells.
Chris re-iterated that the well issue should have been taken to the town and should have gone out to bid in accordance with the town’s guidelines, noting that the First Selectman’s wanted three bids. Dick cautioned that the commission must be very careful to follow the guidelines when dealing with grant money. Dan concluded the discussion by summarizing: Bill will contact Weston & Sampson to get proposal and contract specifications to present to Board of Selectmen, Dick and Dan agreed that design target can be determined after drilling, and Bill will investigate is the drilling and testing can be separate costs to make a motion at next Monday’s meeting.
4. Wettish Project Budget
Dan Colonia stated that the commission selected has a design approved by Planning & Zoning and Inlands/Wetlands, which provides four new fields to meet the needs of the Town of Killingworth. He noted that the design is very “lean” with the only “extra” being irrigation. He added that irrigation is necessary to produce viable fields, but cautioned that to reduce the total cost of the project, the Commission may need to make adjustments, perhaps installing the irrigation in stages or combining in-ground irrigation with water cannons (@ approximately $7000.00 each). Dick agreed noting that in today’s economic climate, large budget items will be scrutinized, adding that this climate will benefit the overall bidding process.
The commission discussed several items added to the project within the past year, after the initial request for funding was made, such as preservation of stone walls and the paving of the emergency ADA access to the fields. Since these items were not included in the project of one year ago, the $1M budgetary constraints of one year ago may not apply today. The Commission discussed other options to reduce costs including applying some of the second STEAP grant funding to the second park entrance, asking for volunteers to rebuilt stone walls, reducing the 10% general contingency item. The Commission believes they can arrive at a bottom line that is reasonable and acceptable to the Board of Selectmen.
5. Presentation to Board of Selectmen
Discussion followed regarding presentation to the Board of Selectmen, and Dick cautioned that if the Board of Selectmen does not support the project, it cannot go to town vote. The Commission agreed that they have engineering estimates, but until the project goes out to bid, they will not have actual costs. The commission agreed to make the presentation to the Board of Selectmen at Monday night’s 7:00pm meeting, with the Park & Recreation Commission meeting immediately following at 7:30pm. The commission also agreed to present Weston & Sampson’s conceptual design with four fields, two fields with in-ground irrigation and two with water canons, and moving the second entrance funding to the second STEAP grant. The stone wall expenses and landscape trees would not be included in the budget since they are expenses imposed on the project by outside sources. The informational package will show the $1.3M total cost, offering options to save money. Dan will contact the First Selectman to be included on Monday’s agenda. Dan believes Eric should accompany him to the selectmen’s meeting.
6. Adjournment
*A motion was made by Bill Silas and seconded by Susan Dean to adjourn the meeting at 10:30 PM. Motion passed unanimously.
Wettish Property Development Advisory Sub-Committee Special Meeting November 6, 2008
1. Call to order
The Killingworth Park and Recreation Commission and Wettish Property Development Advisory Sub-Committee held a special meeting on Thursday, November 6, 2008, at the Killingworth Town Office Building, 323 Route 81, Killingworth, Connecticut.
Present: Dan Colonia
Susan Otto
Susan Dean
Chris Kelly
Bill Silas (arrived at 8:45 PM)
Absent: John Machold
Scott Thomas
Chairman Dan Colonia called the meeting to order at 8:35 PM.
2. Visitors: Eric Auer
Glen Johnson
Richard Otto
3. Well
Dan Colonia stated that he had received two estimates for well drilling from Weston & Sampson earlier in the day:
• Simonelli Well Drilling - $3,555.00 to drill 6” well (the same amount they quoted in August, 2008) and $3,000.00 to test flow and recovery rates.
• Sima Drilling - $3935.00 to drill 6” well and 4100.00 to test flow and recovery rates.
Since the amount to drill is under $5000.00, John Figurelli sent these quotes with the suggestion that Park & Recreation could have the well drilled themselves, without Weston & Sampson’s involvement. This would save the 5% Weston & Sampson surcharge that would be added if they contracted with the Commission to do the well-drilling. Discussion followed between Chris Kelly and Dan regarding whether Weston & Sampson was authorized by the commission at its last meeting to obtain these quotes, or was authorized to present a proposal to obtain the quotes. Chris further questioned Weston & Sampson’s procedures stating that any well-drilling bids should have come directly into Town Hall to prevent collusion between bidders. Chris also questioned why the water requirements were not determined and specified prior to obtaining these quotes, so the Commission would know what water was needed. Eric Auer noted that if an expense is less that $5000.00, then it does not have to go out to bid and added that he felt it was critical to determine how much water is available on the property. Eric questioned why the Commission would want to pay the additional Weston & Sampson surcharge if it was not necessary and Dan further noted that Weston & Sampson had given the town an opportunity to save money. Extensive discussion followed debating the need to drill a well to find water versus the need to specify the required flow and recovery rates prior to drilling a well. Dick Otto questioned whether Weston & Sampson was automatically authorized to solicit bids because they were already under contract with the town, but Chris stated that was not the case.
Dick further suggested that the Commission examine the budget and determine the steps necessary to present to the Board of Selectmen and the Town. Since the bottom line of $1.3M is higher than the $1M cap the Board of Selectmen had implied, Dick suggested the Commission look seriously for ways to reduce costs, and reducing the irrigation expenses might be an option. He urged the Commission to examine the true cost of the project. Eric questioned the Commission’s ability to complete a $1M project if it cannot make a decision on a $4000.00 well, and he confirmed the selectmen’s $1M budget cap. He also noted that if the well issue is not resolved then the budget cannot be addressed. Discussion of the approved concept followed between Bill Silas and Chris.
Glen Johnson noted that Weston & Sampson did in fact give a proposal and gave the town an opportunity to save money. Bill quoted the Weston & Sampson proposal satisfying the motion passed at the previous meeting to get a proposal from them. Glen further offered to witness the well testing and certify the results himself at no cost to the town, adding to the town’s savings. He added that these savings could reduce the overall Weston & Sampson contract by as much as $10,000, but Chris disagreed saying that since the size of the well had not yet been determined it may not save any money. Chris further cautioned that the drilling company could possibly drill down (up to the $5,000.00 authorization limit) and then have to stop without hitting water. The commission agreed that the pump test must be conducted at the same time as the drilling and discussed 6” versus 8” wells.
Chris re-iterated that the well issue should have been taken to the town and should have gone out to bid in accordance with the town’s guidelines, noting that the First Selectman’s wanted three bids. Dick cautioned that the commission must be very careful to follow the guidelines when dealing with grant money. Dan concluded the discussion by summarizing: Bill will contact Weston & Sampson to get proposal and contract specifications to present to Board of Selectmen, Dick and Dan agreed that design target can be determined after drilling, and Bill will investigate is the drilling and testing can be separate costs to make a motion at next Monday’s meeting.
4. Wettish Project Budget
Dan Colonia stated that the commission selected has a design approved by Planning & Zoning and Inlands/Wetlands, which provides four new fields to meet the needs of the Town of Killingworth. He noted that the design is very “lean” with the only “extra” being irrigation. He added that irrigation is necessary to produce viable fields, but cautioned that to reduce the total cost of the project, the Commission may need to make adjustments, perhaps installing the irrigation in stages or combining in-ground irrigation with water cannons (@ approximately $7000.00 each). Dick agreed noting that in today’s economic climate, large budget items will be scrutinized, adding that this climate will benefit the overall bidding process.
The commission discussed several items added to the project within the past year, after the initial request for funding was made, such as preservation of stone walls and the paving of the emergency ADA access to the fields. Since these items were not included in the project of one year ago, the $1M budgetary constraints of one year ago may not apply today. The Commission discussed other options to reduce costs including applying some of the second STEAP grant funding to the second park entrance, asking for volunteers to rebuilt stone walls, reducing the 10% general contingency item. The Commission believes they can arrive at a bottom line that is reasonable and acceptable to the Board of Selectmen.
5. Presentation to Board of Selectmen
Discussion followed regarding presentation to the Board of Selectmen, and Dick cautioned that if the Board of Selectmen does not support the project, it cannot go to town vote. The Commission agreed that they have engineering estimates, but until the project goes out to bid, they will not have actual costs. The commission agreed to make the presentation to the Board of Selectmen at Monday night’s 7:00pm meeting, with the Park & Recreation Commission meeting immediately following at 7:30pm. The commission also agreed to present Weston & Sampson’s conceptual design with four fields, two fields with in-ground irrigation and two with water canons, and moving the second entrance funding to the second STEAP grant. The stone wall expenses and landscape trees would not be included in the budget since they are expenses imposed on the project by outside sources. The informational package will show the $1.3M total cost, offering options to save money. Dan will contact the First Selectman to be included on Monday’s agenda. Dan believes Eric should accompany him to the selectmen’s meeting.
6. Adjournment
*A motion was made by Bill Silas and seconded by Susan Dean to adjourn the meeting at 10:30 PM. Motion passed unanimously.
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